dogfighting with anansi / tormentor

[KINGOFWORLD]

hey everyone,

was just wondering if anyone has any tips for dogfighting? I can fly the anansi / tormentor well and take out ground units fairly easily but i find it hard to control the tormentor and anansi when dogfighting, i notice some flyers have really smooth strafing and circling motions where the anansi / tormentor is tilted on its side flying around you in circles, this is usually the tactic that takes me out.

any tips would be appreciated thnx

[Backdraft]

1. Move your mouse until your aircraft is tilted almost 90 degrees
2. Hold W and strafe key to fly in a circle
3. Shoot at enemy when they get in range and/or locked on.
4. Keep your decoy key ready to fire flares.

Course there's more advanced tactics such as suddenly changing direction mid-strafe, but the tactics above should work for most of the average pilots out there. It doesn't work too well on Dom though.

[Sublim3]

Its a bad idea to dance in circles with the Anansi if your in the tormentor, the Anasi's projectiles are faster so they dont have to compensate the shot nearly as much as the tormentor. If your in the tormentor then take advantage of its faster ROF and spam first with your plasma shots to feel out where they are then switch to Strocket to finish it off.

[KINGOFWORLD]

thanks guys, backdraft do you have any demo's etc? you and dom seem to be the most proficient flyers on here.

[DreAdeDcoRpSE]

I like the tormentor personally, but in dog fighting it has a huge disadvantage, it in it's self has a disadvantage over the Anansi. The Anansi can pretty much keep up with the maneuvers of the tormentor, and in a straight chance with the speed of it and its rockets make it hard to out run and out gun. The tormentors blast are a little stronger but the disadvantage is that they are slow, literally, you can actually out run the strockets in the tormentor. if you get to top speed and fire, you will actually gain a little distance in front of the fire. The range is it's other down fall. As the Anansi rockets fire further, the rate of the rockets is also faster, meaning he can pump more at you then you can at him. So Overall, the best tactic I can give, and this is from going agienst Dom, hit them with the first time and hope you don't get hit, if you do, get away and don't fly in a straight line. For the Anansi, thats easy prey.

But as for dog fighting, always focus on using the strafe and keeping the nose of the craft on the enemy. where he goes you want to point at him or ahead of him if you are using the tormentor. stay on using an upward thrust unless you go upside down, then you want to pitch the nose towards the sky and stay on what would be your downward thrust.

Also using a custom config makes it easier also. Examples are on my QW flying for dummies thread also on allot of other threads. there are many custom threads for configs.

[KINGOFWORLD]

thanks dreaded, i am actually using some of your config :P I meant to say you instead of dom thought you were the same person lol.

here is my config atm that might be useful for you to see.

bind "q" "_weapon0" "" "flyer"
bind "q" "_weapon0" "" "stroggair"

g_bind_context_hornet "stroggair"
bind "MOUSE2" "_weapnext" "" "stroggair"
bind "MOUSE5" "_tophat" "" "stroggair"
bind "s" "_back" "" "stroggair"
bind "w" "_forward" "" "stroggair"
bind "shift" "_sprint" "" "stroggair"
bind "ctrl" "_speed" "" "stroggair"

g_bind_context_anansi "flyer"
g_bind_context_hornet "flyer"
bind "mouse2" "_weapnext" "" "flyer"
bind "MOUSE5" "_tophat" "" "flyer"
bind "s" "_back" "" "flyer"
bind "w" "_forward" "" "flyer"
bind "shift" "_sprint" "" "flyer"
bind "ctrl" "_speed" "" "flyer"

set sensitivity "9.0"
set m_smooth "1"
set m_pitch "0.030"
set m_yaw "0.030"

set pm_skipBob "0"
set pm_bobroll "0.00"
set pm_bobpitch "0.00"
set pm_bobup "0.00"
set pm_runroll "0.00"
set pm_runpitch "0.00"
set pm_runbob "0"
set pm_walkbob "0"
set pm_crouchbob "0"

I find my movements to be pretty jerky and not as smooth as some flyers, like if i stop i might stop and turn but it won't be smooth it might go up a bit and i have to re-aim, do you think it could be some of those mouse settings I got from your config or is my sensitivity up too high maybe?

[Szakalot]

Two things:
1) u cant have to separate cotexts for one thing. In ur case only "flyer" context will work as "stroggair" is overwritten with this :
g_bind_context_hornet "flyer"

2)
Yes, your sensitivity is way to high for a flyer. You can play well with sens at 3 or sth, it requires more movement with your mouse than with a higher sens, but gives more control. And dont be afraid you will not be able to pick up with such a small sens : anansi's turning speed has a limit of its own, beyond a certain point, moving the mouse faster will not boost the turning speed. I play with like 3.2 and i never had a problem with 'not being able to turn as fast as i want'

[KINGOFWORLD]

Okay so do I need to remove these then? are they doing the same thing? I don't really understand:

g_bind_context_hornet "stroggair"
g_bind_context_anansi "flyer"
g_bind_context_hornet "flyer"

And is it possible for me to have a sensitivity toggle? so I can find out what sensitivity is best for me on ground and in the air and just click that button everytime I am on ground / in the air?

[PhotonScatter]

You get a feel of how to lead after flying a while. I can dogfight in the tormentor pretty well, but not near as good as in the Anansi. The Anansi is just better suited for dogfights.

That said, just get good at the dumbfire. Learn to lead, and if flying the Tormentor, get used to using freelook. It's all about practice. I personally fly at the same sensitivity I ground-pound with, and it works fine.

Stop by here, sign ups will start tomorrow. :D

http://community.enemyterritory.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16952

[Szakalot]

Okay so do I need to remove these then? are they doing the same thing? I don't really understand:

g_bind_context_hornet "stroggair"
g_bind_context_anansi "flyer"
g_bind_context_hornet "flyer"

And is it possible for me to have a sensitivity toggle? so I can find out what sensitivity is best for me on ground and in the air and just click that button everytime I am on ground / in the air?

Ok
g_bind_context_hornet "stroggair" is fine on its own.
some binds to this context blah blah blah...
However after you add
"g_bind_context_hornet "flyer"
Your previous commands with a "stroggair" context are obsolete, and only the ones with the "flyer" will work.That is because the "flyer" name OVERWRITES the context naming it, since than
"flyer"
not "stroggair". That is why making two
g_bind_context_hornet will not work, as always the last one will overwrite the previous. Only one of them can work, and its the last one, in ur case "flyer". Any commands bind to "stroggair" are useless.

command to toggle sensitivity?
AFAIR
"sensitivity" is the command? or maybe "ui_sensitivity"
in any case you can toggle it with
"[whatever] sensitivity X Y" Where X is one of the sens you will use, and Y is the other one.

[Azuvector]

With the Anansi, keep your speed high and turn hard and fast(As said above, lift++boost+strafe+a hard turn+pull up; reversing thrust can also help to make a very fast turn if you time it right) whenever you pass by the opposing Tormentor; the ideal situation is where you can turn around faster than they can and are able to take a shot at them and be by them(or following them around) without allowing them to return fire.

By and large, lockons with a LAW are mostly useless in dogfighting with a Tormentor, unless the Tormentor pilot isn't aware of your approach(allowing you to either get really close before launching it, or to launch it just after the Tormentor lights off its flares for some other rocket.)

The rapid-fire rockets the Anansi has are mostly used to whittle a Tormentor down, and to prevent a Tormentor pilot from being able to use freeaim to pelt you with plasma cannon shots while your LAW is reloading.

The LAW reloads quite slowly, so if you have to hold fire a moment for a better shot, do it. A successful tactic is often boosting straight at a Tormentor and firing a LAW at point blank range, as well: you're usually able to dodge their slower-moving Strocket, and if your LAW strikes the Tormentor and they survive, you can also usually ram in midair to destroy them and still survive yourself.

A belly gunner can be a significant advantage in a dogfight, as unlike when you're blasting ground targets, you're usually not able to hold steady and point at the Tormentor, which means they're usually beside or behind you as you whirl around each other to try to get a straight shot. A belly gunner can chew up a Tormentor like a chainsaw while you're in this process, also often forcing them to flee, which lets you follow and go for a LAW shot.

If you play Engineer like most pilots do, drop an AVT somewhere, and try to sucker the Tormentor you're dogfighting into its range. It gives them something nasty to worry about at worst, and at best it'll actually take them out while you snicker.

If you're feeling outmatched in general air-to-air maneuverability but are reasonably confident of your own control, break away and boost to full throttle and drop to ground level. Trees, buildings, etc, provide significant cover from a Tormentor's fire(A smart Tormentor pilot won't try to follow you at ground level; the Anansi is a lot more maneuverable. They'll usually follow you up above.), and if coupled with an AVT can be an excellent way to turn the tables. This works quite well on Quarry and Refinery, for example. Same for Valley: fly under the bridge, or through the tunnel and see if they'll follow you, ideally right into an AVT's field of fire. Or if they'll simply crash or turn away. If they turn away, hey, you've got a free shot at their ass.

In the course of the typical "twisting maneuver" where an Anansi and Tormentor circle around each other, something I find can work well is if you boost straight up, and flip over in midair and come back down on top of the Tormentor. It's quite rare that they'll both know where you've gone if you're quick, and even if they do, that they'll be able to align themselves for a shot before you can.

You can still use freeaim with the Anansi in order to gain a LAW lockon, don't forget, although you can't aim anything via freeaim in dumbfire mode.

Tormentors are largely the same as Anansi, with a few differences: one, they wallow around a lot; they're not very maneuverable, and their reverse thrust is quite poor, making them very reliant on wide turns, rather than the Anansi's ability to slam to a stop, turn almost instantly, and head off at full speed in another direction. They can of course use freeaim to aim plasma cannon shots or Strockets pretty much anywhere they want.

Strockets on the Tormentor tend to reload quite quickly, compared with the Anansi's LAW: coupled with freeaim, if you can maintain range on an Anansi, you can basically spam out multiple Strockets all locked on to the Anansi until their flares are overloaded. You can often take Anansis out with that alone, if they don't back off or shoot you down(Watch for the LAW or rocketspam.)

Freeaim is also useful with the Tormentor during a close-range pass with an Anansi: don't try for a lock as an Anansi flies by you, instead boost forward and freeaim fast to make a snap shot with a Strocket to see if you can tag the Anansi in the side as you go by.

Versus a Bumblebee, your approaches with a Tormentor are a little varied. If they lack side gunners, it's basically a free kill. If a Bumblebee has gunners though(Don't mess with a fully-loaded Bumblebee unless you're really confident: trying to deal with 3 miniguns and 2 rocket soldiers with essentially a 320 degree field of fire isn't a good idea.). The basics of taking Bumblebees down though, are simple: One, don't bother with lockons unless the Bumblebee pilot is lagging or noob: Bumblebee flares recharge faster than your Strockets can shoot. Dumbfire and use freeaim. Two, approach from behind whenever you can. Unlike an Anansi, a Bumblebee can't turn too well, so you can usually stick back there where he can't hit you.

[DreAdeDcoRpSE]

bind "q" "_weapon0" "" "flyer"
bind "q" "_weapon0" "" "stroggair"

g_bind_context_hornet "stroggair"
bind "MOUSE2" "_weapnext" "" "stroggair"
bind "MOUSE5" "_tophat" "" "stroggair"
bind "s" "_back" "" "stroggair"
bind "w" "_forward" "" "stroggair"
bind "shift" "_sprint" "" "stroggair"
bind "ctrl" "_speed" "" "stroggair"

g_bind_context_anansi "flyer"
g_bind_context_hornet "flyer"
bind "mouse2" "_weapnext" "" "flyer"
bind "MOUSE5" "_tophat" "" "flyer"
bind "s" "_back" "" "flyer"
bind "w" "_forward" "" "flyer"
bind "shift" "_sprint" "" "flyer"
bind "ctrl" "_speed" "" "flyer"

set sensitivity "9.0"
set m_smooth "1"
set m_pitch "0.030"
set m_yaw "0.030"

set pm_skipBob "0"
set pm_bobroll "0.00"
set pm_bobpitch "0.00"
set pm_bobup "0.00"
set pm_runroll "0.00"
set pm_runpitch "0.00"
set pm_runbob "0"
set pm_walkbob "0"
set pm_crouchbob "0"


Use this...

bind "q" "_weapon0" "" "flyer"
bind "q" "_weapon0" "" "stroggair"

g_bind_context_hornet "stroggair"
bind "MOUSE2" "_weapnext" "" "stroggair"
bind "MOUSE5" "_tophat" "" "stroggair"
bind "s" "_back" "" "stroggair"
bind "w" "_forward" "" "stroggair"
bind "shift" "_sprint" "" "stroggair"
bind "ctrl" "_speed" "" "stroggair"

g_bind_context_anansi "flyer"
bind "mouse2" "_weapnext" "" "flyer"
bind "MOUSE5" "_tophat" "" "flyer"
bind "s" "_back" "" "flyer"
bind "w" "_forward" "" "flyer"
bind "shift" "_sprint" "" "flyer"
bind "ctrl" "_speed" "" "flyer"

set sensitivity "3.0"
set m_smooth "1"
set m_pitch "0.030"
set m_yaw "0.030"

set pm_skipBob "0"
set pm_bobroll "0.00"
set pm_bobpitch "0.00"
set pm_bobup "0.00"
set pm_runroll "0.00"
set pm_runpitch "0.00"
set pm_runbob "0"
set pm_walkbob "0"
set pm_crouchbob "0"

I have my mouse sensitivity that high cause its not just for flying, its also when I am on the ground. Some people say having it that high means nothing, but there is a difference, I can notice it on my PC.

As for what was said in a previous thread by Azuvector, where he said the Anansi and the Tormentor is pretty much the same. That is far from the truth. Over all, the Anansi is over powered towards the tormentor and I hope SD fixes that in the next patch. I try staying out of dog fight as much as I can with the tormentor, but if there is an Anansi devastating my team, then I take the task of taking them out. I find most of the time if I come up slow on them, they wont hear me. Unlike the Anansi, the Tormentor is extreamly loud and can be easily heard while trying to sneak up on them. so take it slow and try not to lock on till your pretty close. The closer you are, the less time they have to fire decoy's.

If you are confident in your flying, then you can do what I do sometimes and charge them and head straight for them at top speed, one I think they are in range, I fire a barrage of Strockets and Plasma at them and at the last second I will pull away. If I didn't take them out but they are hurt. sometimes its easier just to ram them rather then shoot them. You will take damage, but if your at full life and they aren't, you should be fine, just get to a safe spot and land fast and repair. Ramming is usually the last resort but one note. DO NOT SHOOT WHEN YOU ARE LITERATELY ON TOP OF THEM, you will kill your self. I do that once and a while. :cool:

[KINGOFWORLD]

Thanks for the information guys and for fixing that cfg dreaded!, I am still getting used to the free aim, I didn't realise it was that useful ? I just don't like it when you free aim and you are stationary / have no control

[klo8]

Try to get them down while they don't notice you, sneak up from behind and aim carefully. Unguided strockets are better, too.

[Szakalot]

Thanks for the information guys and for fixing that cfg dreaded!, I am still getting used to the free aim, I didn't realise it was that useful ? I just don't like it when you free aim and you are stationary / have no control

i dont think free aim is that good. Helpfull in 'some' situations, but not overally used by me, then again, im flying anansi only.

[DreAdeDcoRpSE]

i dont think free aim is that good. Helpfull in 'some' situations, but not overally used by me, then again, im flying anansi only.

Free look is good but like you said, only in certain situations. I don't use the Anansi that much any more, but if I remember right, Free look in it was almost worthless to begin with. I think its more of a tormentor thing which I use primarily. But like I said before. I would never use it in a 1 on 1 fight with an Anansi, cause I am almost certain to loose. The Tormentors strockets/plasma are way to slow and trying to use free look and trying to stay moving so the Anansi doesn't lock on is just stupidly retarded. by time you get a lock, or just about to have a lock, and the Anansi pilot is some what familiar with it, then you would be dead before you can fire.