Rushing objectives to keep them alive

[Aegeri]

One thing I've started to do and have noticed is extremely effective, is rushing an objective to keep it alive. Basically, the worst objective to get stuck on (IMO) is the EMP and yet it's by far the easiest to rush. You can rapidly get in behind it (using a husky or just running there) avoiding a great deal of the strogg team. Alternatively, you can run through the front and jump onto the EMP objective from the window.

Basically, my goal as engineer is to deploy an AVT (If I think it will be needed) on the hill and then consistently rush the EMP. It doesn't matter if I live 2 seconds or get 10 seconds of building, every spawn I try to get to the EMP as fast as possible. In most games, the strogg have never really been able to hold off such a rush (by myself or others in fact), because it turns out if you build an objective/hack it (whatever) it seems to reset the timer before you lose any progress again. So if you make a sustained attack upon the EMP/Sewer control you can often win just by piling up enough corpses around it.

This has the added effect of forcing the strogg into defensive positions, making your teams artillery more effective and stopping the strogg from harassing the hill spawn etc. Either that, you manage to just complete the objective because you've already constructed 90% of it by your 7th or 8th death

This is not a good strategy to use if you care about your K ratio though. I think I died almost 10 times in 3 minutes before I managed to build it one game, killing only 2 strogg. Importantly though, because I kept building the objective we never lost any progress we made and eventually a teammate finished it off.

[paZifist]

yep works really well. But only with teammates that got brains. And that is what you dont see often on Publics

[murka10]

this tactic sounds impossible and generally a waste of time, better when the team disables the AIT and blows one hammer at it and build an AVT somewhere and revive the engi is much better.

[HellToupee]

its possible alright, i usually go from the other spawn and use a vehicle to get close.

[Czin]

Man I tried this earlier this morning and it was hilarious. I'm sad to say that it totally worked. The brave defenders shot me down in ~2 seconds of building but even so after ~4 minutes of repeatedly running in and diving into the gen it was built. I'm 99% certain that I was the only one building it.

Not saying its unstoppable... but it sure doesn't take much work and seems to rock on these pubs

[Hakuryu]

I use that strat all the time.

Going to the EMP:
1. Through the back 'door' cutout in the wall
2. Through the blowable gate
3. Through the side door (garages)
4. Up the ladder and then jump down to the obj (favorite)
5. Around the area and come through the back side directly by the obj

... are the routes I use to do this, usually never taking the same one 2x in a row. Unless the Strogg have someone that knows what they are doing and catches onto me, I can build the EMP pretty easily.

[lem0n]

Well the tactic espacially work well if you cooperate with 2 engeniers. Usually some Stroggs only shoot the 1st one down but forget about the second one.

[Aegeri]

The reason this works is because few strogg ever actually defend the actual EMP anyway. They are usually either around the sides or doing something random up in the hills in the surrounding area. If you take advantage of the sprinting speed and how maneuverable you are, it's quite possible to break a stalemate by just running in constatly like a lunatic.

Also, if they have AITs, the best way of dealing with it is to run past as fast as you can. Trying to engage the turrets wastes precious time and you'll often just get killed anyway. They key thing is if you build/touch an objective even if it's only for a second you won't lose your progress for a good while again. So you can wear it down over time.

[Ifurita]

Another good route to take it to climb up the ladder on the outside of the multi-storey building, then jump down onto the EMP gen from there. Sometimes you can jump right into the defensive ring of Strogg defenders

[zig-zag]

Works great for Sewer control hack too, but is a bit trickier getting there in time. spawn covop and run with your knife out, use lower entrance into sewer compound, ramp jump the first stairs into the water in front of south grate, ramp jump the grate stairs to jump thru the tunnel (over any strogg on the other side too, ramp jump stairs on other side of grate, and dash like mad for the rest. Usually going full speed, noone can touch you until you reach the controls. The run is quick enough not to decay the objective. Rinse and repeat.

[PeaceKeeper]

The tactic works great, is pretty cheesy over all IMO.

I'll use it as long as it is there tho, I like cheese.

I think instead of a global timer to make the progress 'suddenly' go away, it should just start ticking down from however full it is. This way, you don't lose it all immediately, which I think is the point, but using the zerg rush isn't as effective. Sure it will still work, but it will take more effort and probably more than one engineer to pull it off.

[reyalp]

This engineer/covert zerging can be very effective, but it doesn't really strike me as great gameplay. I have often built the EMP by pretty much ignoring the enemy end just rushing to keep the build going. This works best if you wait for your team to create some kind of distraction.

It absolutely does pay to pay attention to how long it has been since the objective was touched. If you have it half way built, a few suicide rushes to keep it alive while until your team gets another push together can make a big difference.

[Aegeri]

Yeah, zerging only works at the moment because the strogg haven't learnt to defend the EMP. I've been able to hold off zerging pretty effectively all game, but then again, I defend the EMP rather than run around.

[zig-zag]

Yup, my main thing is to just touch it to keep it from decaying, not necessarely to finish it.

[Aegeri]

Originally Posted by zig-zag

Yup, my main thing is to just touch it to keep it from decaying, not necessarely to finish it.

Yeah, this is primarily why I do this. I don't actually expect to complete the objective against a good strogg team, just keep progress we've made on the objective alive.

[PeaceKeeper]

Originally Posted by zig-zag

Yup, my main thing is to just touch it to keep it from decaying, not necessarely to finish it.

And this is why defending can only do so much. If it's halfway done, one engineer jumps from the roof and touches it, timer reset.

I don't care how 'good' you claim to be, odds are you aren't going to stop them from resetting that timer. Mines, not fast enough... Nail Gun, too late, it's been touched... etc.

I think the idea of having it start to decay immediately from however much is done would work much better overall.

[zig-zag]

Well at least for the hack, the Strogg can move the defense line farther out, or retake the forward spawn. This kinda foils the zerg rushes for the second part, at least until a covie sneaks in

[Tomme]

If u rush it at begining with a few mates its piss, strogg never bother defending first thing :P

[Ifurita]

That's also why you have to push the D out a bit and just cluster around the gen

[reyalp]

Originally Posted by Aegeri

Yeah, zerging only works at the moment because the strogg haven't learnt to defend the EMP. I've been able to hold off zerging pretty effectively all game, but then again, I defend the EMP rather than run around.

Keeping an entire team from touching it once a minute is very hard, even with a pretty skilled/organized team. There are enough routes in that you really can't just set up one or two killer crossfires. Support fire limits your ability to do this as well.

The current hit detection problems play some part in this, but the fact remains that there are a lot of ways in. If you push the D out, chances are they can slip in another way.

[CarbonFire]

I agree that its almost impossible to prevent the "keep the drive alive" touch by the engineer once a minute.

Either a faster clock, to prevent a single engineer from being able to 1 second build it over a series of minutes (but not necessarily multiple engineers) might be a good balance. Or possibly a short delay and then a decay (like PeaceKeeper suggested), where the progress meter slowly empties if no one has touched it after say 15 or 30 seconds.

If it remains the way it is now, there will be NO WAY the Strogg could prevent the first objective from getting completed, as all it would only take is one rogue engineer or Covert Ops to keep the objective from reseting, thus negating an entire team's worth of working.

[Czin]

Its probably intentional that strogg cant keep the first objective from being completed as they have a pretty strong advantage when it comes to defending the last obj anyway. ^^

[CarRamrod]

Originally Posted by Aegeri

One thing I've started to do and have noticed is extremely effective, is rushing an objective to keep it alive. Basically, the worst objective to get stuck on (IMO) is the EMP and yet it's by far the easiest to rush. You can rapidly get in behind it (using a husky or just running there) avoiding a great deal of the strogg team. Alternatively, you can run through the front and jump onto the EMP objective from the window.

Basically, my goal as engineer is to deploy an AVT (If I think it will be needed) on the hill and then consistently rush the EMP. It doesn't matter if I live 2 seconds or get 10 seconds of building, every spawn I try to get to the EMP as fast as possible. In most games, the strogg have never really been able to hold off such a rush (by myself or others in fact), because it turns out if you build an objective/hack it (whatever) it seems to reset the timer before you lose any progress again. So if you make a sustained attack upon the EMP/Sewer control you can often win just by piling up enough corpses around it.

This has the added effect of forcing the strogg into defensive positions, making your teams artillery more effective and stopping the strogg from harassing the hill spawn etc. Either that, you manage to just complete the objective because you've already constructed 90% of it by your 7th or 8th death

This is not a good strategy to use if you care about your K ratio though. I think I died almost 10 times in 3 minutes before I managed to build it one game, killing only 2 strogg. Importantly though, because I kept building the objective we never lost any progress we made and eventually a teammate finished it off.

Have fun catching a face full of lead from my APT and then stomping on my mines I laid so nicely around the objective just for you.

With a nicely set up defense you can have most anyone dead before they even get a sliver of bar up on the EMP.

[daveh]

Mines are easily countered by a nade throw to cause them to explode. APTs dont do enough damage fast enough to matter to you reaching the objective and adding to the build count.

[reyalp]

Originally Posted by CarRamrod

Have fun catching a face full of lead from my APT and then stomping on my mines I laid so nicely around the objective just for you.

APTs are easy enough to avoid if you pay attention, they have a limited field of view, and you can see them from a long ways off. Mines on the objective itself don't really matter, because by the time they go click... boom you've done enough twisting to keep the objective alive for another minute.

If you do this every time you obviously don't make much progress, but realistically, you don't die instantly every time.